Ice Sheet Issues

Tim Cullen has posted an interesting comment on the presence of life in ice sheets – it’s somewhat prolific as he shows here.

What this means is that the chemistry of ice sheets becomes somewhat problematic because if biological life is an active component of ice sheets, and as life on earth is also carbon based, then the presence of life and CO2 in ice sheets would present some new perspectives.

 So CO2 in ice sheets cannot be assumed to be equivalent to the chemical equivalents of fossils in ice strata, and thus an accurate proxy of past CO2 levels.

This needs to be factored into any discussion about CO2 at Watts Up With That post on CO2 as a start.

And perhaps the work of Louis Kervran becomes relevant because his research indicated that “life” can alter the character of atoms and molecules – so if the ice-life system involves CO2, then I would not be too dogmatic about the validity of C12/C13 isotope ratios measured in polar ice sheets etc.

And one might also navel gaze over how to snap-freeze animals like wooly mammoths found buried in the Siberian Tundra – the trick is to kill such an animal and at the same time stop any bacterial putrefaction on death. Stopping bacterial decay is necessary to preserve the mammoth in the tundra.

About Louis Hissink

Retired diamond exploration geologist. I spent my professional life looking for mineral deposits, found some, and also located a number of kimberlites in NSW and Western Australia. Exploration geology is the closest one can get to practicing the scientific method, mineral exploration always being concerned with finding anomalous geophysical or geochemical data, framing a model and explanation for the anomaly and then testing it with drilling or excavation. All scientific theories are ultimately false since they invariably involved explaining something with incomplete extant knowledge. Since no one is omniscient or knows everything, so too scientific theories which are solely limited to existing knowledge. Because the future always yields new data, scientific theories must change to be compatible with the new data. Thus a true scientist is never in love with any particular theory, always knowing that when the facts change, so too must he/she change their minds.
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5 Responses to Ice Sheet Issues

  1. fabio says:

    Hi, Louis, here I am again criticizing some references, but when I do that I do not want any affront, but I aim only at scientific accuracy. Where Kevran’s experiments with eggs composition well controlled ?

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    • Fabio, he was a professional scientist, so I presume he understood the protocols.

      I recall reading, some years back, in a letter published by The Journal Of Scientific Enquiry from a British chemist that they could not replicate his experiments etc. Except they tried to create potassium from nothing, while Kervran pointed out that potassium was transformed from sodium by the human organism.

      The tone of the letter was that of an ad hominem, unfortunately, but Kervan’s ideas were/are not popular because they challenge the belief that life is an epiphenomenon of an inanimate physical universe; his experiments suggested the reverse.

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  2. PeterMG says:

    Many of man’s greatest achievements in science and engineering have been made by mavericks or those with imagination, rather than those who are stuck following the rules. When it comes to looking at life, and its relationship to the physical world, “Settled Science” is stuck in a rut and can’t see the wood for the trees.

    Your example of how a woolly mammoth has been frozen in time is a prime example where settled science not only struggles to explain how this could happen, but actively discourages open debate where we leave nothing out no matter how implausible. I have my own thoughts and it involves electricity and radiation, but I could be completely wrong, but at this point so is everyone else. But someone somewhere will one day discover a missing link allowing us to put together a fuller picture. But if Science refuses to accept they are wrong, then we can’t have the conversations that will provide the food for fertile minds.

    If we understand the woolly mammoth and how it because frozen without decay, then we may be able to better explain the dinosaur fossils, and in turn explain why the fossil record is so haphazard in the geological timeline, which in turn is probably rubbish.

    Our technological advances with scientific instruments (which often does not require us to fully understand the why only the how) are providing answers to the why that don’t fit the current accepted why’s. Rather than rejoice science is currently seeking to suppress just like a religion.

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    • Peter,

      I distinctly recall reading a National Geographic issue in which they had an article on dinosaurs. There was one photo of a dinosaur skeleton embedded in sandstone but the animal was upside down. The photo was shot in a fairly large excavation operation. Whether the article was about Bakker or some other ‘famous’ palaeontologist requires research. I’m not sure what intellectual gymnastic feat was offered to explain that fossil, or I forgot it.

      A similar mystery surrounds the Devonian Red Beds in the British Isles and the embedded fish fossils. How the heck does one replace a fish cadaver with ‘sandstone’ unless those fossils are flat imprints on a bedding plane; more research needed.

      What your observations above describe is technologically sophisticated religion. One thing we might conclude from the Old Testament is that the disasters seem to be descriptions of cataclysmic weather or climate events caused by external forces or bodies, comets or planets. Once the divine or cosmic fracas subsided some human survivors transformed the physical deities into metaphysical deities or abstractions. The most revered Islamic site is Mecca and the K’aaba which houses a meteorite fragment; Velikovsky reckoned both the Jews and Muslims were Venus worshippers. Maybe, no probably right. So we are originally Pagans or planet worshippers?

      One theoretical obstacle I had was assuming that protons could not penetrate solid matter but that depends on the nature of the object. Submit a negative electrically charged object to a rain of protons, our wooly mammoth as an example, then what might happen to it? Theoretically it should allow the protons to enter the bulk matter since it’s electricity. Maybe it’s a massive electric short circuit that also zaps the bacteria at the same time? To test this would need the fabrication of a proton gun ?

      Or is the catastrophic appearance of massive numbers of high energy protons in the lower atmosphere sufficient to cause a surge of electrons out of the Earth itself and preferentially pass through any conducting object, life forms for example, instantly killing it, on its way to the over-head proton cloud? One account of a frozen mammoth was that it had an erect penis indicating death by suffocation. Another creates another problem, how to suffocate an elephant.

      As a digression, people who survive a massive climate catastrophe, or as recounted in Mankind in Amnesia, the atomic bombs used at Hiroshima and Nagasaki, tend to conclude they must have been chosen by providence, etc, and hence are the chosen ones. Add a good dose of amnesia, and many generations later the survivors only know from tradition that they were chosen by God, or Providence, and hence logically, the rest or others weren’t.

      Given the chicanery associated with climate science, where the past is being rewritten to suit present day policies, I am now wondering how much of the past was also rewritten to support ancient policies? Things never change, and hence why Gunnar Heinsohn sticks to the stratigraphic evidence in developing his theories of fabricated history.

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